W conversion fuel pumps?

[cul8r]

Hey all,

Just out of interist what sort of fuel pumps do any of you use when you've put a g***w into your cars? Was told they need to be low pressure? Which I found a little strange given EFI systems are generally higher Psi..

Atm I have two pumps, both look identical to me, a JE Camira pump, and a VL pump..

Im planning on finding a low pressure pump as a lift pump (leone pump or golf) and one of the above mentioned pumps for supply.. But if they are meant to be low pressure then I'd need a fuel pressure regulator to run them, correct? In which case I'd just be better off running low pressure pumps?

[IZU069]

The pump must suit the system - ie, 3psi for Weber carbies, or whatever Hi-psi for whatever EFI setup you are using. (eg, if using a Delco, grab all the sensors & attachments that come with that Delco including the fuel pump.)
I think the VL is the same as Camira (both are Delco 808?).

[cul8r]

Yea the VL and camira pumps are near enough identical - plugs the only difference..
I've scored a subaru leone for a lift pump, so that with the camira pump (tis a bit quieter than the VL pump, and in better condition)

You dont happen to have any information/pics on the original pumps used? (I'd imagine these'd be intank pumps?)

[IZU069]

Original pumps for what?
G200W? From a Piazza? (Ask the Kiwis)

But the original pump shouldn't matter - you just need to provide the required pressure with at least the delivery required for the EFI you are installing.
Or are you using the original G200W ECU and injectors? (Piazza or 117?)


Poida can probably provide some good info.
I liked the idea of a local (engine bay) circulation system which potentially required no plumbing modifications to my older fuel systems (single outlet & vented) - just a low-pressure pusher (lifter) pump from the tank to a hi-pressure pump & circulation tank in the engine bay (dare I call it a "surge tank" after having enjoyed knocking the for years?). That was based on a system that Poida or one of his associates once described.

And BTW - the addition of a pre-pump should not require the addition of a pressure regulator. (Though I have no doubt it can be set up to require one.)

[cul8r]

Thanks, yea sorry at this stage stock g200w ecu/management & injectors

G200w From a piazza, the g180w is from a crashed zz/t - sadly didnt keep the fuel tank or setup as this was before I owned the running gear from it..

And yea Im getting a surge tank in the above mentioned method made up, using the low pressure as the lift pump, and the camira pump as the supply..

Do the motors come with a fuel pressure regulator attached, or was this at the tank end?

[bellett65]

The motors do not generally come with a regulator. I used one from a Camira. It work OK.

Peter

[antus]

im running a similar setup on mine - delco efi, with a generic bosh pump, and a barina fuel pressure regulator with JD camira MPI injectors (orange top, part number 0-280-150-205, 16.2lb/hr). The fuel is coming out the tank with the original carbie in tank low pressure pump, then running to a surge tank before the bosch pump. I have the ecu tuned to suit and it works well. The tune is available at http://delcohacking.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=7&t=375 if you want to run it.

[Greengem20B]

Im running on my G180W,the standard sohc gem intank pump as a lift pump into a generic Bosch style pump, no surge tank just a fuel reg off a Camira also....

[Poida]

The JD 1.8L MPI EFI (Bosch) Camira, JE Camira, all Holden Calibra models, The VK EFI models, the standard VL Commodore, the VL turbo and the VL Walkinshaw, VL Grop A SS Commodore, VN Group A SS Commodore, the Series 1 VN Commodore, NV & VP V8 Clubsport, BA3 Honda Prelude, 86-93 straight 6 & V12 Jaguars, Lada Niva 1.7 litre EFI, W124 chassis Mervedes Benz, all Peugeot models, all Renault model (think that is enough to prove the point but it isn't the complete list) all use that same pump!
Do the research and you will find it.

These pumps can obviously supply more fuel than is needed for any 4 cylinder engine when you realise they are being used in many high performance applications with far greater fuel capacity needs. They are more than capable of working as a pump mounted below the tank (so they gravity bleed) pushing full fuel rail pressure to the injectors without the need for a low pressure primer pump or a swirl pot. They are an externally mounted EFI pump. Some of the cars in the above list also have internal tank mounted primer pumps as well but you only need that if the pump can't be mounted in a position where it automatically gravity feeds. A normal Gemini TX-TE in tank pump would be more than you need to serve that purpose.

The key issue is that the pump can provide adequate quantity and pressure to the fuel rail so the pressure is always more than the fuel regulator setting. Remember how it works, the fuel rail is pressurised and maintained by bleeding pressure built up that exceeds the pressure cut point of the regulator. Sort of same principle as a bucket, keep filling but it can't hold more than the point it runs over the side. This is why I am often amused when people go off fitting all these high pressure, high volume pumps because the regulator will still bleed off at 43psi if that is where it is set to.

I wouldn't bother looking for more exotic fuel pumps. These do the trick nicely, they are NOT noisy when you mount them in the cradles they are fitted into in their OEM applications and should be readily available at just about any wreckers yard in the event your pump fails when you least expect it. One of my principles of modifying these cars/engines and especially any alternative EFI system (Delco in my case) is every component is readily available second hand from wreckers should I experience a breakdown on the road.

[IZU069]

One of my principles of modifying these cars/engines and especially any alternative EFI system (Delco in my case) is every component is readily available second hand from wreckers should I experience a breakdown on the road.

But don't you need a specially constructed CAS for the Delco?
Sorry - I couldn't resist! (FYI for others - the Camira & N13 etc Delco does NOT use a CAS! Later ones might - but not those....)

I can't help but agree with the common spares aspect (hence the RG dizzy - ie, RB reluctor guts in Gemini dizzy for ALL G-series engines - OHV, GZ & GS SOHC & GW DOHC). (Oh - and delco's - albeit locked and ignitor to sit preferences.)


I agree too that that those pumps are fairly proven, and quiet. (Hmmm - no Fords? LOL)

I'm still surprised that people confuse delivery (quantity) with pressure.
Then again, so many still reckon the oil-pump determines (sets) oil pressure. But at least we seem to be beyond the "more powerful engines need higher oil pressure" days. (I won't mention delco....)

Good to have some meaningful info.... thanks Poida!
(It may be that Antus is using the hi-pressure (& surgetank) "localised to the engine bay". Geez Poida, wasn't that idea canned? (I won't mention O....)